Scott Horton Interviews Justin Raimondo

Scott Horton, November 04, 2008

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Justin Raimondo, editorial director of Antiwar.com, discusses the 2008 presidential election, how transitions in government tend toward continuity instead of radical change, the competing policy influences in an Obama administration where Dennis Ross and Anthony Zinni are possible National Security Advisor appointments, how the only difference in foreign intervention between Democratic and Republican administrations is rhetorical, how the neocon parasite feeding on the Republican party will soon leave its shriveled host behind and search for greener pastures, the continuing danger of war with Iran, realist/neocon policy toward Russia, why a vote for Nader is the best medicine in the current corporate-socialist economy, and why the Constitution and Libertarian parties may be one party too many.

MP3 here. (40:30)

Justin Raimondo is the editorial director of Antiwar.com. He is the author of An Enemy of the State: The Life of Murray N. Rothbard (Prometheus Books, 2000). He is also the author of Reclaiming the American Right: The Lost Legacy of the Conservative Movement (with an Introduction by Patrick J. Buchanan), (Center for Libertarian Studies, 1993), and Into the Bosnian Quagmire: The Case Against U.S. Intervention in the Balkans (1996).

He is a contributing editor for The American Conservative, a Senior Fellow at the Randolph Bourne Institute, and an Adjunct Scholar with the Ludwig von Mises Institute, and writes frequently for Chronicles: A Magazine of American Culture.

31 Responses to “Justin Raimondo”

  1. Nice conversation, and nice last thoughts before having to choose who I’m voting for….

    I do think I will ultimately vote for Nader, since I live in a non-swing state and since the Bill of Rights is the central issue of the day, which obama has not sufficiently taken a stand on. But I do also think there is a tendency for many honest intellectuals to be far too dismissive about Obama. Of course, we need to be realistic, and the pressures that drive US policy aren’t going to disappear, but there is a lot to be said about where he’s come from intellectually. This guy was an anti-apartheid activist at one point after all, and as McCain has chosen to remind us, he has also been friends with people like Rashid Khalidi, whose book ‘Resurrecting Empire’ reflects the kind of understanding I would want the president to have. Not to mention Reverend Wright who clearly understood the relationship between our actions and Islamic terrorism.

    Israeli Likudniks and other neocons say that they are “not fooled” by obama’s apparent conversion to a centrist-interventionist. I think they have a point, and we should moderate our own expectations accordingly. If I were in Obama’s position and I wanted to make changes for the better, I too might pretend to buy the mythologies about Iran, Afghanistan and all the rest.

    Maybe he’ll be worse than Bush and I’ll eat my words, but I’m personally hopeful about what a person like him might be able to do. There’s a lot of fluff and flash on the exterior, but underneath it I believe is some genuine, non-negligible character substance. At any rate, I certainly don’t expect him to blatantly thumb his nose at the antiwar movement that got him where he is.

    We’ll see I guess…

  2. How can you guys so blithely dismiss the concerns of the 9/11 Truth movement, while in the same breath noting Nader’s outing of the 2 McCains regarding Israel’s attack on the USS Liberty? I believe it was the mulligan we granted Israel over that incident that emboldened them to do 9/11. And you yourselves have elsewhere reported on the Five Dancing Israelis. How does that disconnect work?

  3. Yup, AW.com is double standard to the max… They are there to string along the malcontents (and get their money) while the grand agenda goes on.

  4. Thank you Chris Lester and 8Ball. I was also shocked by Raimondo’s recent written accusation that militant Muslims were probably the cause of the car bombing in Georgia targeting Russian officers, whereas it is just as likely that Mossad did same, since it also does car bombings and is shown to be targeting Russia.

  5. No secret, pro-’the real culprits of 9/11′-agenda here. We just don’t believe that the U.S. or Israel did it. That’s all.

    It was al Qaeda that did 9/11. And do you have a shred of anything that would even imply that the Israelis following the hijackers around this country were doing anything but watch them? (A story which Justin has covered second to none in the world) Do you?

    I mean really. Y’all expect us to believe that Atta, Hanjour, al-Midhar, etc. were secretly working for Israel? I suppose Ayman al-Zawahiri works for them too? Give me a break.

    Oh, but no! The Antiwar.com guys are just facilitators of the “Grand Agenda”!

  6. They’re right Scott it was all planned in Israel and Ayman al-Zawahiri is just their front man. His real name Ayman al-Jewsteinbergwitz.

  7. Scott, do you have any evidence that “al Qaeda” did 9/11? Oh, that’s right, they found Atta’s passport in the rubbish of the twin towers, two steel-frame buildings that fell at near free-fall speed due to the intensity of the heat that melted the steel, something that has never happened before in the history of the world and that is scientifically impossible. But Atta sure had a tough passport!

    What is “al Qaeda”? Is it a tangible organization, like the Taliban? I would ask Justin to do a story on this, with the same intensity that he used in covering the Israelis. He might find out some interesting things that current and former intelligence officials, here and abroad, have to say about the legitimacy of good old “al Qaeda.”

    I would imagine that Justin, in covering the Israelis who followed the hijackers around (and did a “second to none in the world” job), discovered that a few of the “hijackers” were involved in some pretty serious partying down in Florida, including alcohol, cocaine, and women. Sounds like some real devout, fanatical Muslims to me! Did this ever occur to him?

    Paul Craig Roberts hasn’t been afraid to speak out against the absurdity of the official story of 911. Why is antiwar.com? It doesn’t mean you have to immediately indict Israel or the U.S. government. What it means is that you don’t accept the official story based on reasoned analysis, and you demand a new inquiry. Do you accept the official story?

  8. General Zinni taught a class at William & Mary while I was there. The guy is a hardcore Hawk and he has a fetish with Shaving off beards from Arabs. He see it as de-masculating them. On his Lectures on tape he went on a 3 or 4 minute tangent about it.

    I’m just glad that the Bigot Elizabeth Dole is out of office from NC and John Warner VA Finally resigned as well. Not a fan of Mark Warner (he certainly can’t fix I64) but he is a vast improvement from John.

    Dan they didn’t find Atta’s passport at ground zero (although that was reported in the very beginning) it was a different hijacker. But yeh the story is just as lame. One can reject the official story without latching one to some equally kooky story from the conspiracy cults.

    I pretty much proved Israel sent that Anthrax and had a working spyring in the US to generate the Iraq War and connect it to the anthrax and Al Quaeda. It’s wrong to say Al Qaeda does not exist. They exist there is plenty of evidence for that. Just how separately they operate from the CIA now that’s a different question. We know our own State Dept and CIA have been selling illegal weapons and drugs on the blackmarket and then getting more money to police their own networks. And of course Josey Hadas was part of the 93 bombing and the FBI has a pretty shaky story there too.

    Who was behind 911? Well here is the anthrax team.

    Omit Suter (Levinson)
    Michael Gal
    Ophir Baer (bailed out by Amdocs)
    Hanan Sertfaty (money man for the anthrax ring)
    Legun Yochai (ran the hoax letter and patsy monitoring)
    Lior Baram
    Dilka Borenstein
    Marina Glikman
    Tomer Ben Dor
    Michael Calmannovic
    Peer Segalovitz
    Philip Zack
    Charles Kushner
    Richard Perle

    A separate team ran the New York Operation, not Mossad or CIA it was all NGO lackies. I have a partial list of some of them based on who was stealing passports and who bailed out the truck bombers but as well as the truck bombers but it seems to me more like a “let it happen” operation more than a made it happen. Urban Moving systems wasn’t going to bomb the towers but tunnels and it got all screwed up. Anyway as for the towers themselves that’s obvious. I mean the Pentagon was hit too and that wasn’t Israel. That was JJ and DZ with their “missing” 2.3 trillion. I mean with the MIC there are just too many people who would benefit it’s hard to pin it on a single mastermind.

    I know the president of AIG held a meeting flat out screaming that planes would hit the towers that whole month of August. I got an employee on tape from Japan telling me all about it. A lot of people made money selling shorts there it was something that a lot of people knew about but only in a vague way. I mean Neocons were going on the radio saying “stay out of tall buildings” months before the attack. And several radio hosts predicted it happening and that Osama would get the blame/credit.

    The problem is it all got steered into this complete asinine bullshit about the illuminati/free maison/vatican/alien/fill in the blank.

    Justin has done a great job talking about the art students XTC ring and spy ring as well as the role (possible role) of Philip Zack in the anthrax. And he wrote a book sub titled the 911 the Israel connections. I’m pretty sure he might believe a little more than he can write because its circumstantial evidence. He’s a paid writer with a lot to lose, not just a blogger he can’t just say whatever he thinks even if he is pretty damn sure.

    And Scott is not close minded to the idea he just gets flooded with all the disinfo crap so much that it really puts him off to the whole idea.

    They’ve both covered the conspiracy of the Iraq war the lies about Niger, the role of the OSP, the staged Saddam Statue toppling, the Miller and Libby ring, and Justin he brought up the question about Jeff Gannon and how he knew so much so fast about the Plame outing. But he didn’t trace it back to the Kunsher and MEGA groups (that I know of) but he did say “How did Gannon who worked for a fake news agency[and a male hooker] have access to internal government memos?”

    I mean these guys (scott and Justin) know about the real conspiracies, they know about Iran Contra, they know about the Russian Oligarchs, they know about the media spin and lies about the Georgia conflict, the rigged elections in the color coded revolutions (a phrase Justin helped to coin) [I would throw in the Valclav Havel velvet revolution in that group as well a long suspected CIA op] they know about the lies protecting Israel’s daily war crimes, Scott has been all over the WMD lies from the start as well as the post Iraq War lies, Justin questioned the rational for the strike on Syria (and was right) Scott followed up and has also been all over the coverage of A Q K and Sibel’s case probably more than any other mainstream internet publication. Justin has gone over two bogus poisonings one in the Ukraine and the Litvenenko scandal and Scott and I talked about that on the air with the same conclusion a botched smuggling operation (something I wrote to Raimondo right after it happened) So these guys know what’s up. They are not opposed to conspiracies in general. Justin is one of the only people to really cover the Yushchenko slef poisoning and I am surprised that never picked up more steam. They listen TO EVIDENCE.

    You just have to spell it all out and stick to facts. I got a DVD in the mail to Scott actually. I certainly don’t follow the official story of 911. I’m with you guys. But you got to explain you’re selves with good facts, (like why were there truck bombs at all and what happened to them?) I sent Scott that clip and had to explain that that was a totally seperate event form the Urban Moving crew caught dancing. It was actually 3 different vans.

    But when you say one liners from you know who like “no steel building has ever fallen from fire” that’s just meaningless. So what? They don’t normally get hit with planes either. And just because something hasn’t happen doesn’t mean it won’t or can’t. Those are class C or D arguments.

    -Ry

  9. Can we have the definitive evidence that absolves Israel of any involvement? I mean, its fine to rain all over any mention of Israel’s involvement, but what evidence do you have that proves the negative? It seems to me no-one can say for sure.

  10. What about the exercise of two planes hitting the towers taking place at the same time as the actual attack ? And no aircraft went up to follow the hijacked planes as is standard procedure ? And Rice´s call to a black mayor not to fly that day-if it can be confirmed. But the dancing (Mossad?) “Art students” Israelis on a hill outside N.Y. as it happened ?
    Anyway, President Obama said Iran should be barred from importing gasoline. That´s a Declaration of War, the same as HR 362 and SR 580 which were shelved for now. Does Obama long to go back to 1932 and for no reason at all. There´s ZERO evidence Iran is pursuing a nuclear weapons program.

  11. Conspiracists: Come on now. Get past it! Now’s the time to push a return to non-interventionism, in the intervening months. Agitate, advocate, educate, communicate, all of those good things. Expend some ink to forward action–rooted in critical reasoning–while there is time to influence the outcome of cabinet and administration selections. Justin: “At least the other side will have some voice–his opposition…defeated Hillary…that gave him the initial surge.” So, get down to the business of preventing an expansion into Iran, Afganistan, Syria…, and, advance the commencement of the draw down from Iraq. Call Obama to act. Call newly elected Senators and Congressmen to influence, support, and to vote for non-intervention–again!

  12. Scott Horton, Justin Raimondo,

    All conspiracies aside, the plain fact of the matter is that Barack Obama will end up where G W Bush wanted to go, he will simply do it at a slightly slower rate of speed and with an infectious smile on his face. I drew three columns of policy programs and positions and legislation passed/signed into law with columns A and B being both Bush and Obama and column C being Ralph Nader’s policy program and it angered people that I proved without doubt that Bush and Obama were one and the same (having either voted/signed into law the same bills policy prescriptions with the Wall Stree bailout being number one on the list )and that Ralph Nader was the only true logical choice. But all in all, even though I appreciate AntiWar.Com I still have not forgiven you guys for trying to make a Saint of Pat “I was for Bush’s wars before I was against them” Buchanan.

  13. All we need to know is From General Smedley Butler. The names change
    but the game is always the same. Debt for the Masses Riches for the few.
    The companies change their names but the “winners” are the same. The War
    Pimps live and prosper and the soldiers come home and if they are “lucky like Larry”
    maybe get a “decent” job. Unfortuneatly the economy is not too good right now.
    The Rich get richer like in WW 1 and the Debt goes up and then you have to figure
    out how to pay for the War forever and ever and ever. Amen

    WW 1 and WW2 and Korea and Vietnam and Now always the same Winners
    so to speak.

  14. Leaving aside questions of how incompetent the intelligence agencies were, or what kind of foreknowledge the administration had at what time, I can tell you that the 9-11 truth movement is extremely confused about the engineering issues.

    You really can’t make a credible case that a 767 colliding with the towers at 500 mph, followed by 10,000 gallons of burning kerosine would not have been enough to bring the towers down. This is the same jet fuel that, when burned, has enough energy to propel the airplane from Boston to LA. And you think you can ignite it all in one place, and it wont produce enough heat to weaken a steel skyscraper to the point of collapse? Do these people know what a 767 looks like? Give me a break. Im not saying we should accept the NIST report (or any of the other studies) as gospel, because its a complex engineering problem, but every so-called “scientific” explanation I’ve come across as to why the “official conspiracy” is wrong about the collapse of the towers has been extremely naive to say the least.

    In a certain sense I am pleased that so many people have expressed such skepticism, because it reflects a certain mature understanding of how leaders exploit fear for their own purposes. But I’m telling you, anyone who claims that they can “prove” that the WTC collapse must have been a controlled demolition is a quack. This is exactly how so many FoxNews-conservatives have allowed themselves to be convinced that global warming is a hoax. Because its really easy to make a nice sciency-sounding case, and make it sound like you know what you’re talking about when you really don’t.

    You’re doing a great job Scott.

  15. The sheer wieght of ‘conspiracy theories’ – which by the way are conspiracy facts when they suit – suggests that the art of confusing the masses is at play, the same art which has since led Americans to forget about ever finding the truth about JFK’s murder.

  16. Cliff’s logic about the kerosene is laughable.

  17. Once again Justin does his “no choice but to vote least evil” bit. Again I ask: what US Govt atrocity is it gonna take for Justin to call on his readers to Vote Molotov?

  18. 1. Why did the CIA withhold the alHazmi/alMidhar intel from 01/00 through 08/01? This conduct appears to rule out Bush vs. Clinton arguments since the protection spanned both administrations. Don’t people want to know why Presidential Medal of Freedom winner George Tenet has put forth a contradictory account? He claimed he and officials at the CTC were freaked out about a possible terrorist attack. OTOH, he and officials at the CTC were withholding al Qaeda related intel at the very same time.

    2. I’ve listened to author James Bamford’s book tour interviews. In one he admits the NSA had the legal authority to obtain FISA warrants and/or notify the FBI so they could obtain the warrants. Yet he also makes the case that Hayden failed to follow this procedure because he was overly cautious about civil liberties. His case for Hayden doesn’t make sense. As Bamford himself notes, the choice wasn’t between illegal warrantless surveillance or nothing. Hayden had a legal option to go through the FISA court which was set up to protect civil liberties.

    3. After the alHazmi/alMihdhar intel was shared with the FBI it was withheld from the Cole investigators. The FBI ITOS (headed by Michael Rolince) not only obstructed the Cole investigation and prevented the Cole team from finding alHazmi and alMihdhar but they also obstructed the Moussaoui investigation. We have agent Samit and agent Rowley both wondering what on earth headquarters was doing.

    I don’t understand why people are looking to Israeli, Saudi or Pakistani operatives for answers when the attack took place in the US. The people who refuse to tell the public what happened are US officials. After 9/11, the intel community received increased funding and increased powers. Nobody in the intel community was held accountable.

  19. I’ve adopted a reductionist approach to 9/11. I no longer list the endless anomalies. All I feel obliged to say is, we spend a trillion dollars a year on a military that can’t protect its own headquarters from a big lumbering airliner with two hours notice. What if something sophisticated threatened them/us? Huh?

    But the ~100 videos of the Pentagon hit are too sensitive to release — al Qaeda might put them on YouTube and make fun of us.

    That is too much for our poor bedraggled military to bear!

  20. Scott / Justin,

    One of the reasons voted for Nader is he agreed to open a new 9/11 investigaion. After attending a presentation authored by Archetechs and engineers that proved the buildings could not have fell from the inpact of the Airplanes alone. They presented no conspiracy theories just the physical impossibility of the offical story being true. They presented clear facts and evidence that it was a controled demolition. The question is why would the terrorist engineer a controled demolition and slamed the planes into the building, doesn’t make sence? You guys should look into this.

  21. [...] the Left now that they have gained even more seats in the halls of the US’s Imperial State, have listen to Justin Raimondo. Learn why Obama is a dangerous man and the democrats are no different than the Republicans in so [...]

  22. I am no fan of Cindy McKinney what so ever, but anybody who claims to be after the truth and hasn’t looked in depth into what has come out of the 911 Truth Movement overall is in a serious state of complete obvious denial. The evidence is overwhelming and obvious, and anyone refusing to personally research into that matter and learn from it is only making it extremely obvious to all other people that have how much of a fool they actually are.

    Either spend the time or learn to lose.

    http://www.yuwie.com/clubs/club.asp?id=6398

  23. To all those who say that the Israelis were involved: No direct evidence. Only circumstantial. It can be argued Israeli interests were furthered, but so were Iranian interests, as well in some ways Russian interests, or even Cuban interests. Also, it could’ve been done by someone who’s strategy backfired (such as a group hosted by the Taliban-Al Qaida) or Saddam Hussein.

    Furthermore, no one making those claims of responsibility has direct access to anything involved, without the exception of intelligence organizations whom no one seems to believe anyway if they don’t buy the official story.

    I’m not saying it was anything, really. I’m saying you can point the finger at any country, and since people in America have only heard of Iraq, Israel and Iran, naturally most people are into some conspiracy theory brewing there, or in America itself. No one really knows what happened, and anyone who says otherwise is more than likely lying. The standard of proof needed for anyone who has an opinion is too high, and everyone has their biases anyway.

    What do I believe happened? A bunch of psychotics went nuts for a few months and four of them killed themselves and took the others in the bunch with them (voluntarily or involuntarily-its not clear that all the hijackers knew they were on a suicide mission!). Wouldn’t be the first time in history. Wouldn’t be the last. Al Qaida? Probably. But it doesn’t matter. Whomever it was were murderers thinking that they would do something.

    By this point debating over the blame is pointless. We have real consequences of choices made, and no one is offering real, pragmatic solutions.

  24. To be clear, I’m not saying Saddam was involved in 9/11. I’m saying that his interests, personally, were not furthered by the event.

  25. People in these threads don’t read anything, they just come in and argue, that is why they really don’t know anything.

    Knowledge is work, it can’t be injected into your brain like an IV. So sorry, you’ll have to break your own sweat on it. Stop wasting other people’s time.

    I told you where to go.

    http://clubs.yuwie.com/911truth/

    Research where all that takes you. Answer your own questions by doing your own research. If you don’t know how to do that yet in life go back to school until you learn.

    I told you where to go so stop sucking off other people’s tit to get anywhere in life.

    “There is a method to their madness, there really is not much method to yours, because you are operating from a place of ignorance and until you change that you are going to be bumbling around bumping into to each other saying and doing the wrong things, not understanding the nature of your enemy and if you don’t understand the nature of your enemy and the weapons they use, you can not fight that enemy. You can’t fight the battle. You shouldn’t even be on the battlefield. You don’t even recognize half the weapons they use against you, and some of them seem so insignificant you don’t even try. That’s why you are losing the war. Now don’t tell me you’re not, you don’t even try.” – William Cooper

    “…a nation or world of people who will not use their intelligence are no better than animals who do not have intelligence. Such people are beasts of burden and steaks on the table by choice and consent…Those who will not use their brains are no better off than those who have no brains, and so this mindless school of jelly-fish, father, mother, son, and daughter, become useful beasts of burden or trainers of the same.” – Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars

    Don’t be 9/11 stupid, grow up soon.

  26. I read through some of that stuff, and its inherently flawed:

    1. The government controls the information
    2. We do not believe the government
    3. Here’s our solution

    The problem here is first, there’s always going to be skeptics. If the government really was competent enough to put out a deception effort (which I doubt they are), they’d put one which would not be obvious. But there’s a logical error here a la Star Trek.

    Assume verything the government tells you is a lie.
    The government says “I am lying right now”

    This is why you can’t go by the opposite of the government. If the government is lying, then its telling the truth. If it is not lying, then the assumption is flawed. The reality is just because you don’t trust someone doesn’t mean they’re not telling the truth. Similarly just because you trust someone doesn’t mean they’re not lying. Why on earth should I believe you more than the journals I’ve seen and things I’ve read, which are peer reviewed and nearly every influential scientist reject such conclusions? The answer is simple: There’s no credibility to believe you any more than the government. So the conclusion to 1 is that at worst, you can not make any conclusions based on government information, and that includes cover up.

    Notice I am not saying there was no cover up. I honestly believe though there was no cover up. I will probably die an old man believing that. But I can’t prove it. And you can’t prove there was a cover up since the information you collect is usually random, unexplained factoids that have no real impact, but you think is something that can’t be accounted for (since you can’t account for it) and thus, SOMETHING must have happened (heaven forbid the same government that has had crisis after crisis do something competently). The reality is if you’re really skeptical about government power, which a lot of Austrian Economists (and people here are), then there’s very little way the government could pull all of this off. And if you believe the government can be that efficient, that kind of means the public sector must be more efficient than the private sector, which makes the whole Austrian school kind of flawed. Of course, then, this means private individuals would control the government in that school to do this, which the conspiracy theorists believe anyway: Well, then in the absence of a strong centralized authority criminals will take over, thus rendering the Austrian school wrong again.

    No, the government response simply was one of failure. There’s no real evidence of a US conspiracy, or a conspiracy of its allies. One problem people have is conspiracy theorists always believe that they’re smarter than everyone else, therefore enlightened. There are thousands that work for the government, in the security fields alone. First, ask yourself how smart you are compared to the normal public. Next, ask yourself how smart these people are, including those who make decisions. If you’re as arrogant as you must to think you’ve reached some new conclusion and everyone else is blind, congrats! The people in government don’t know what they’re doing. Thus the thousands of people needed to keep quiet about their actions and what they saw…not one of them has a chance at being “enlightened” and talking and putting the pieces together, right? And any organization, if they could pull off what happened and a cover up, they can surely shut down your internet service or find some sort of other way to shut you up, right?

    Newflash: You’re not that important, and your continued existence presents the biggest problem with your theory.

    And then, furthermore, what if the government-the ones we elected-are doing this? Who will defend us? We elect and trust in you guys and then you do the same things down the line? And with this paranoid streak in which everyone who isn’t enlightened might be a conformist or worse? Where does this “quest” end?

    No thanks. I’d rather not go into Stalinism on your behalf. Especially if people in your ranks are lying too. That gives you as much credibility as those imaginary ghosts you claim to be fighting. The most skepticism I can offer you is that we can’t know what happened. For all we know in your analysis, a bunch of pissed off Vikings on mushrooms did it because they wanted the Danegold and to punish the English speakers for not paying it for hundreds of years.

    This country needs less blame to find out what happened and actually deal with its problems. As insensitive as this sounds, there’s more to life to worry about than 9/11, Waco, Oklahoma City, USS Liberty, and anything you want to throw out. That’s: Will I have a job, will I be able to get food, will my family be able to eat, will my neighbors have the same problems, and how can I save in case I can’t do those things?

    From there we can go forth: How do we end our wars and have a more just yet free society? Nowhere do I see conspiracy theories ending our current problems!

  27. All this is really beside the point, because you are one lost guy. I told you where to go but you would rather bang your head into the wall over and over again, so I really can’t help you at all.

    The fact that governments are big and clumsily and all the rest is one reason why criminal networks are able operate within them. You think that governments are capable of sniffing that out, they aren’t. You think that criminal rogue networks operating inside the US government are too stupid to do such a thing and the US government is too smart among others things to not catch them at it and tell you about it but 19 Arabs, some of which survived the crash, and a guy on dialysis in a cave in Afghanistan can pull it off.

    My advice for you Jim is to forget 911, you can’t handle it. You don’t have the discipline. You can’t wrap your brain around it right now, so don’t even try to attempt it. I told you where to go and you didn’t go, so why fight it, go do something else and forget it. When you can’t handle something you need to get out of the way of people that can.

    No entity kills more than governments do by a huge margin, go look it up. Murders tend to murder until they get caught. Go back to sleep Jim and forget this stuff.

    http://clubs.yuwie.com/911truth/

  28. If governments are big and clumsy, they can not stop it. If they are small, then they can’t stop it either. Thus, it would be obvious that the relationship to the government and 9/11 is relatively small, since there is no realistic relationship. If you disband the government, a criminal gang will simply spring up in its place, and not prevent things. All you needed to pull off 9/11 is a bunch of motivated psychopaths with an opportunity. You don’t need religion, you don’t need really anything, except a few psychopaths in a room together. They could be of any ethnicity. They could be of any religion. To deny there aren’t 19 psychotics in the Arab world that happened to be in the same room together is ridiculous. That situation can happen anywhere.

  29. Well I don’t think you have noticed yet but governments are full with psychopaths, because they have protection there and it’s respectable for them to be that way there. That is not to say that everybody in government is bad. What I am saying is that state is a magnet for bad people because its legal force. I know you would like to think that the government is there to protect you, but they really are incapable of doing that.

    The 911 Truth Movement general conspiracy theory for 911, for people that have one, is basically that 911 was orchestrated by a state and non-state criminal network up to the highest level to increase the world ruling elite’s control over the planet. Actually I think most people stay away from that in the 911 Truth Movement, because it’s just too scary, they just don’t think the government’s 911 conspiracy theory makes any sense giving the facts.

    If the world used sound money 911 type things would not be happening.

    http://clubs.yuwie.com/911truth/

  30. Some people think the government just let it happen. Some people think the government made it happen. Some people think that elements in the government were involved in the orchestration of it. Some people are just are not buying the government’s conspiracy theory based on the known facts. Other people believe the government’s conspiracy theory regardless.

    http://clubs.yuwie.com/911truth/

  31. Flase flag type operations and the Austrian school of economics have nothing to do with each other. You are talking about are two completely different things and trying to use one to disprove the other which is bizarre how you can make any sort of sense out of that inside your brain.

    Putting the morality of coercion aside, Austrian economics says that state centralized planning is inherently flawed by economic law where liberty is not.

    That state ownership over the means of production cannot increase overall wealth and raise people’s standards of living to the degree that individual ownership over the means of production can in the long run. That collectivism is more destructive to economic life than liberty is over the long term.

    The Austrian schools of economics certainly does not say anywhere that governments are incapable, due to economic law or anything else for that matter, of killing their own people or doing false flag operations against anything or anybody else for that matter. Governments have been killing people, whether their own or not, since there have been governments.

    http://clubs.yuwie.com/911truth/

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