Scott Horton Interviews Gareth Porter

Scott Horton, February 02, 2012

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Gareth Porter, investigative historian and journalist specializing in U.S. national security policy, discusses Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Martin Dempsey’s warning to Israel’s government that the US would not be dragged into war with Iran by a unilateral Israeli attack; why Iran might hold the US accountable for an Israeli strike anyway, and counterattack US targets in the region; Mossad’s general agreement with the US National Intelligence Estimate on Iran (that there is no evidence Iran has decided to pursue a nuclear weapons program); and why Israeli Defense Minister Ehud Barak seems to think Israel isn’t ready for military action.

MP3 here. (19:50)

Gareth Porter is an investigative historian and journalist specializing in U.S. national security policy. The paperback edition of his latest book, Perils of Dominance: Imbalance of Power and the Road to War in Vietnam, was published in 2006.

46 Responses to “Gareth Porter”

  1. A point sorely missed by most observers of the rising tension between the West and Iran is that even the most foolhardy and hawkish advocates of war with Iran know that a land invasion to affect a regime change is ruled out; and in that case for as long as the military conflict is confined to conventional weapons Iran would be in the position to dictate the inevitable process of escalation or de-escalation which would follow.

    This of course is not an outcome that the proponents of war with Iran have in mind. They hope that after the conflict gets started the pain of continuing the conventional war for the West in lives and treasure will hopefully rise so steeply that it becomes natural for the public opinions in America and Europe to accept the use of nuclear weapons against Iran in order to end the war.

    Even then – that is after America or Israel have dropped their first nuclear bombs on Iran – it is not at all given that Iran will stop fighting and surrender.

  2. 'bout time!

  3. DARKNESS
    Aren Haich
    "the proponents of war with Iran have in mind…
    the use of nuclear weapons against Iran in
    order to end the war."

    LIGHT
    No nation will again drop the A-bomb, as the world would rise up against it and in quick order destroy it.

  4. It's a US election year. I suspect this is just more political maneuvering to get candidates to fellate AIPAC to the maximum extent by professing their loyalty to another country.

  5. DARKNESS
    The two parties to this interview function under the principle that the 1% High Society controls the agenda by brainwashing the voting majority into enriching themselves upon the misery of the world, brutal imperialism for plunder being the lubricant that gets things done

    Solution: Convince the innocent and ignorant voting majority of the truth.

    LIGHT
    Reality being quite the reverse, for the 51% most educated, most wealthy and most greedy, they are the voting majority who always vote for the president who best gratifies greed, that is why minimum wage for the impoverished 49% is economical slavery.

    Solution: Start a new Occupy movement, an Occupy 51% Most Greedy movement, the first American Revolution ever.

  6. " … the world will rise up …"
    There is no such "world" to rise up. There is, on the other hand, the public opinion in the West; and that can be easily manipulated given the right circumstances and motivation.

  7. hi y’all
    :)
    Just to say Scott that your podcasts are without equal and they are the best source for true international affairs analysis. Gareth among others never fails to inform.

    As for Israel vs Iran, I’d like to think that even Obama won’t go so far as to kiss Bibi’s ass yet again, and the US is (finally) seemingly telling them to ease off, but sadly Bibi and the neocons (a) have their hearts set on attacking Iran and (b) are crazy enough to do it regardless of the consequences and (c) Bibi might do it just to piss of Obama and scuttle his re-election. We know that the Likudniks and neocons don’t give a damn about anyone else anyway.

  8. Very interesting. The thing that strikes me is that whenever the president has a disagreement with Israel he has to be extremely cautious to hide it or confront it in a very discreet way. It's like walking on eggshells. And there's always the chance that he will have the rug pulled out from under him by the American media, or politicians who are ready to give Israel the keys to the treasurehouse. You can never tell who is secretly acting as an agent for Israel. Maybe we should rewrite the titles of our officials, for instance: The American Secretary of State for Israel, etc.

  9. Not to worry.. congress will act in accordance with with their master in Israel. When the boss says jump they'll ask how high.

  10. I'd like to know how the ancient enmity between Russians and Persians plays into the extreme rise in Russian emigre population in Israel and in their influence on its politics.

  11. When you sanction irans banking sector, you are preparing for war. when you sanction irans oil industries, you are preparing for war. When you assassinate iranian scientists, you are preparing for war. The US has been preparing for war for a long time. They just have to come across to the public that they are little angels after Iran attacks their facilities.

  12. heard gingrich on hannity, i think its funny that everyone from far left pacifists (who dont believe in any war )to hard core cold warriors like buchanan think messing with this whole iran thing is a historically bad idea…im a republican and im ashamed of the callous attitude towards this conflict, the disregard for the potential disaster that awaits the world if we act unilaterally…..im not naive i think its entirely possible if not likely iran will attempt to build a nuclear weapon but i think we need to allow the world community to act with us as opposed to the reckless course we are on , im angry at the irresponsible attitude from politicians and anyone who disregards and diminishes the loss of life in a war by being gung ho about military action that could engulf the world in nuclear disaster, and i do believe that obama has the right idea, lets see what iran has on the table before we act, and then maybe we can get more support for military action from russia, china etc., even the russians arent wholly trusting of the iranian regime and their ambitions, if we think this out instead of acting with the usual reactionary policy we are known for we can be sure we will have more friends if and when we do have to act on this

  13. Comment on CommonDreams.org — Of all self-love feel-good places

    “What’s new today is that MANY more people are awakening to their inner voices that tell them they don’t want a chance to “move up the ladder” because it means a master/slave relationship, and we don’t want to be our brother’s master. The cat’s out of the bag. The elites are butt-naked. And they are BROKE. I’ve never seen any group so absolutely discredited. It’s a very scary time for the elites. It’s the people’s dawn on the horizon.”

  14. Why would Iran stop fighting. Do you not think they saw the results in Iraq. They had to hang Saddam and I believe he did everything possible to avoid being attacked but the oil was too tempting to Richard Perl and the band of thieves.
    I believe Iran will continue like Iraq until they eventually win. If anyone believes we or Israel own Iraq is a fool.
    Iraq is a fiasco which should have been avoided. Iran is a disaster which could redefine our society because of the bad things that could result.
    People should understand that Iran is being attacked because Iran blocks empire Israel. Israel is out of water and they cannot invade Lebanon to steal the water as long as the Lebanon militia have a source to get resupplied military equipment. The 2006 Israel invasion was a disaster and they know another invasion with an armed enemy would be very costly in IDF lives. Better nuke Iran and then attack the defenseless Lebanon. It is the basic nature of the zionist movement.

  15. You are correct and look at the fact that we rushed the bunker bombs to Israel. Do you really think that if you give a weapon to the IDF that they will not use it? This is all a posture in case the attack goes badly. The USA will say they tried to stop it and the Israel will cry victim. Look at the present position that if Israel attacks Iran the USA will attack Iran if they respond and bomb the people who just attacked them. Our position is much like the idea that Canada would attack the USA if they responded to Pearl harbor by attacking Japanese interest. They will attack because Israel is out of water and Israel is a desert.

  16. Israel never would ask a congressman or senator to jump. They would demand they send more weapons so Israel can defend against the arab nations who hate Israel. Maybe if one understands that they hate Israel mostly because Israel has a bad habit of murdering arabs or bombing old arab woman and children. Israel has started every military conflict except 1973 which was the direct result of the 1967 war of aggression started by Israel.
    The hourse of representatives and the US Senate is nothing but a bunch of prostitutes. They will do anything for campaign money which AIPAC floods on the right people. They cannot win elections unless they give that money back to the media interest owned by the big members of AIPAC. It is much like the political situation were they vote billions for Israel and Israel gives millions back to the very few political types. A nation could go broke with that fiscal insanity.

  17. The extreme rise n Russian move to Israel was the result of Russia allowing them to leave in exchange for the USA military secrets stolen by J. Pollard an Israel hero. A very large number of those Russian only stayed in Israel long enough to move to another place. Most actually ended up working in the USA.

  18. I want to amend my previous comment. This is the last US prez election before the Iranians will probably have the break-out capability to enrich U235 to weapons grade. An attack on Iran in the Spring or Summer would "force" Obama to join in or be politically attacked by the repugs for being weak. Thus, election politics could incite the US to do something stupid simply because the two factions of the corporate/bankster party want to win the election regardless of the US best interests.

  19. @anthony dituri
    not only you are naive, you are also a brainwashed fascist. a republican defending o’bombYa? geting russia and china onboard for a war? Go and talk to your ethic or moral (if any left). Stupid redneck!

  20. Its better for you not to watch fox Anthony Dituri.
    Fox ‘fox’ with your mind. Hannity is a neuro-linguistic programer.
    Search the web for NPL and/or Hannity NPL and you’ll understand.

  21. That’s a very strange question Will !!
    Russians, Persians enmity and jws?
    Its like asking why does rats move from barns to sewers, given the enmity between dogs and cats.
    Rats move not because of dogs or cats but because of access to food.
    Under Yeltsin’s miserable looting of Russia, lots of Russians moved abroad, including to US. And now they return cause circumstances have changed.
    Why do jws think everything is about them? Its not? If Israhell did not massacre Palestinians nobody would have noticed them. DO YOU UNDERSTAND?
    What I like to know, given the enmity between Iran and Israhell why don’t jws leave Iran for Israhell??

  22. We have probably blown it all up several times and afterward forgetting all about it. http://www.mcremo.com According to Der Spiegel 49/2011 the Pentagon´s disarming first strike capability will be operational by 2020. Of course, this leads to Launch On Warning.

  23. correction: thas NLP not nlp

  24. ……..like Staten Island. It has become Little Russia Via Israel Island.

  25. What you see helps explain why they become powerful. They get to count the citizens of Staten Israel among the 7 million citizen of Israel so they can claim they are the majority. If they live in Staten Island and Israel that makes one person worth two in the power.
    What is also something that has to be questions is the billions of dollars that are provided. How much federal money does that Staten Israel person get and does that same person get a part of the many billions provided to what appears to be a questionable number living in Israel.
    What is needed is a very good investigation as to who lives and how should the dual citizens be counted. It would make a major difference in Israel if the arabs are truely the majority and only the game of dual citizens allows the minority to rule. They are a democracy and the majority should be the rulers.
    BTW Staten Island is only one of a very large number of places with the same situation.

  26. Israel wanted to attack Iran as soon as we attacked Iraq. It's all about the "un" balance of power. Which means reducing every countries military in region to sling-shots. All real experts know that Iran is not making a nuke and has the right to have power-plants. Israel isn't afraid of Iran targeting them, Israel is afraid that Iran will have a strong economy that is efficient. Israel has at least 250 nukes with every delivery system even subs supplied by Germans. As an American I am concerned that Israel will use it's military to manipulate the west.

  27. People believe in the Bible, The Quaran, The Talmud, whatever. It´s all nonsense. The truth may help us -www.mcremo.com Someone made the 300,000-year-old coin found in Illinois. And the finely elaborated 300 mio-year-old gold chain which was found. And a beautiful 600 mio-year-old vase. We don´t know who we are and from where we came. But the things found, also the Piri Reis map, indicate that we´ve blown it all up several times. The Bishops wrote the Bible 333 in Constantinople. There is no Rapture. Even Gingrich talks of the Rapture. It´s a fantasy. Half of America thinks that Darwin is the Antichrist. There is no Antichrist. He died maybe only about 300,000 years ago in the last all-out nuclear exchange.

  28. Copyright© class war — Registered® class slavery

    Knowledge like matter, it is neither created nor destroyed, as both have existed since time eternal. So, inventers, designers and song writers, most all of the 25% most wealthy, they are not creators, but discovers.

    And so, before any knowledge is discovered, does not nature already have a Copyright© on it? And after knowledge is discovered, as nature has all knowledge based on and Registered® in the laws of physics — is not all such rights, privilege and wealth given away freely for the good of mankind?

    Think about is, if knowledge is free to all before it is discovered, then should it not always be free to all who care to use it?

    Reflect on it, if there was never a reward for discovering knowledge, then maybe the A-bomb would never have been invented and 220,000 civilians in Japan would not have been vaporized into thin air.

  29. Regret deeply the happenings of it, for if the 25% most wealthy and greedy had no Copyright© nor Registered® excessive wealth to be gained from it, then still living in log cabins and eating off of the fat of the land we would be, and our environment would out of harm’s way be save unto perpetuity.

  30. John Ellis
    No nation will again drop the A-bomb, as the world would rise up against it and in quick order destroy it.

    Aren Haich
    “There is no such "world" to rise up. There is,
    on the other hand, the public opinion in the West;
    and that can be easily manipulated given the right
    circumstances and motivation.”

    John Ellis
    The rich nobility that have always rules Empire USA, they ordered President Truman to give the Manhattan Project highest priority so that the A-bomb could be dropped on Japan at the time most perfect for terrorizing the world into submission. So, just after the war had already been won and just before the negotiations for peace would begin, Truman was ordered to drop both A-bombs in quick succession. For the rich knew that the world would rise in rebellion if ever the A-bomb was again to waste human life for any reason. For the rich rule the world by terrorizing our emotions and they know just how far they can go.

  31. As to the West being easily to manipulate, actually no. For until humanity reaches the ultimate conclusion of greed, the 51% most wealthy and greedy in all Western nations will always strive to maximize greed and to gratify to the extreme all the emotional pleasure they can derive from greed.

  32. @Claus Eric Hamle
    its all about permutations isn’t it? like prime numbers, some of them pretty easy to notice some not.
    some people are more afraid of dying than killing. and when they do; they suffer from post-trauma-syndrome. where do you suppose intelligence resides?!

  33. Come you masters of war You that build the big guns You that build the death planes You that build all the bombs
    You that hide behind walls You that hide behind desks I just want you to know I can see through your masks
    You that never done nothin’ But build to destroy You play with my world Like it’s your little toy
    You put a gun in my hand And you hide from my eyes And you turn and run farther When the fast bullets fly
    Well like a Judas of old You lie and deceive A world war can be won You want me to believe
    But I see through your eyes And I see through your brain Like I see through the water That runs down my drain
    You fasten all the triggers For the others to fire And then you sit back and watch When the death count gets higher
    And you hide in your mansion All the young people’s blood Flows out of their bodies And is buried in the mud
    You’ve thrown the worst fear That can ever be hurled Fear to bring children Into the world
    Oh for threatening my baby Unborn and unnamed You ain’t worth the blood That runs in your veins
    How much do I know? Oh to talk out of turn You might say that I’m young You might say I’m unlearned
    But there’s a one thing I know Though I’m younger than you That even Jesus would never Forgive what you do
    Well let me ask you one question Is your money that good? Oh will it buy you forgiveness Do you think that it could?
    I think you will find When your death takes its toll All the money you made Will never buy back your soul
    And I hope that you die And your death will come soon I’ll follow your casket By the pale afternoon
    And I’ll watch while you’re lowered Down to your deathbed And I’ll stand over your grave Till I’m sure that you’re dead

  34. 'israel' the U$virus must fanish.

  35. Obama says, "No"? Hahahahahaha,,,,,, (wiping tears of cynicism aside)… Are you serious? Coming from the same criminal who said he'd do away with Gitmo and also wouldn't sign the NDAA? The man is evil.

  36. Godfather Obama has made a secret commission to decide secretly if an American shall be drone-killed. If the President does it, it isn´t illegal. Obama is a Psycho – and Professor of Constitutional Law ? It´s not strange if earlier civilizations committed suicide out of sheer madness.

  37. He has to be cautious because he fears for his life as well as his families safety. However, the mossad will not hesitate to do away with him if they feel it is necessary..

  38. oh yes, the mossad. even mighty Emperor is afraid of. poor minority (of unknown origin) bombYa!!!
    Any other apologies? Maybe he has flees and only mossad has the cure.
    not likely as much as I despise those M##@$F#^@$s
    It would have been plausible if you’d said cia though ;-)
    or mossad by the order of cia

  39. speaking of WHICH here is to our murderer, be-hated emperor may lightning strike him soon

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/obamas-peace-prize-about-be-confiscated-nobel-peace-prize-jury-under-investigation

  40. indifint Amer&can = UE Khalifah Aaed

  41. uh oh…looks like Obama is in for another one of Nathan Yahoo's bitch slappings!!

  42. Exactly. Will the US public ever wake up to the realities, or will religion win in the end?????

  43. The US has already used radioactive 'depleted' uranium shells in the former Yugoslavia and Iraq. Israel has used white phosphorous during its invasion of southern Lebanon and in occupied Palestine. Let no one underestimate the lunacy of these war machines. World public opinion means nothing to them.

  44. The Manhattan Project was started under President Roosevelt… Just saying…

  45. "There is no such "world" to rise up. There is, on the other hand, the public opinion in the West; and that can be easily manipulated given the right circumstances and motivation. "
    Agreed. If the world opinion is NOT manipulated, we won't be here to even discuss this war as to why we need to fight it.

  46. "Solution: Start a new Occupy movement, an Occupy 51% Most Greedy movement, the first American Revolution ever. "
    Great. And look at how effective the Occupy movement is…
    The sad reality is that it is NOT the public's votes that determine what this country will or will not do. It's the president (and the congress to a certain degree) which a certain political lobbying group has dis-proportioned influence…

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