It’s rather shocking that this is really happening, here, in the United States, in 2010. Park51/The Cordoba House, an Islamic community center that, mark my words and those of the mayor, will be built in Lower Manhattan, is being hysterically opposed by all manner of dingbat in the land, though it is likely to have more square feet of basketball court than prayer space. Which doesn’t quite make it a mosque. And yes, peeling back further layers of this stupid onion, who does care even if it were a mosque? In fact, there already are two mosques in the “Ground Zero” area! I could go peeling more, but this onion is boring. The fun one is Newt Gingrich.
Newt Gingrich, impossibly to my mind looking toward the presidency in 2012, is demagoguing his way into a Twilight Zone of logic that makes me want to just sit in front of him and stare at his face as if he were talking in tongues, because that’s about as much sense as he’s making. The most scintillating bit of Gingrich logic goes something like this: Why should “we” allow a mosque to be built near Ground Zero when one can’t build a church or synagogue in Mecca? You see, now the West is using the likes of Saudi Arabia as a moral barometer. Not that Gingrich is the type to be shy about the idea of theocracy. If they start building Park51, I say Newt should go stone those infidels.
Speaking of Bush allies, don’t you almost long for the days when Bush would just declare Islam a religion of peace and blithely continue his war on Muslims? It was insane in its own way but it kept the rest of Insane America quiet. Indeed, many are calling for the former president to weigh in on the issue, because of Obama’s typical waffling.
I’ve been to this area several times — “several,” as opposed to “often,” because the Financial District, and especially that part of it, is not a place to hang out. In fact it was a “Ground Zero” decades ago when a real neighborhood was evaporated through the power of eminent domain to build a complex of monstrous, needlessly tall office towers in a public-private Corbusian nightmare of setbacks and concrete. And what is replacing this is hardly an improvement. But I digress, as usual. I have really only ever been there to go digging through cheap designer clothing at Century 21 department store, across the street from that big hole in the ground.
This all brings me to the point — is “Ground Zero” particularly hallowed? Across the street, you can dig through bargain bins. All around the site are ugly, tacky, trashy, vulgar, base things for sale. In this vein, New Yorker Daryl Lang set out to photodocument the vicinity. Titty bars, gambling dens, Irish pubs, fast food, schmata hovels, and even, yes, tables on the street selling little jingoistic lucite Twin Towers emblazoned with The Flag. And people are upset about an Islamic YMCA?
But even if it were a mosque, and even if this were “hallowed ground,” one can’t help but notice the hypocritical heights to which the Stupid American will soar to keep something scary and alien at bay. In the course of a Facebook conversation, someone mentioned a comment she heard from a high school student, unknown to me (such is the nature of Facebook):
“Well, to be fair, we’ve built a lot of ‘Ground Zeros’ near mosques in the Middle East since 2003.”
At least someone is thinking in our schools.
I wonder, oh how I wonder, how the nifty guys at AntiWar.com are gonna come out on the Nancy Pelosi remarks wanting the Feds to investigate opponents of the Ground Zero Mosque.
Twistin' and turnin' oh yeah, those in the AntiWar wing of the libertarian movement. They're so in favor of "personal liberty," and were so opposed to the "fascism of George W. Bush," spying on American citizens and so forth.
And now it's a Democrat. A San Francisco Dem no less, right there in the backyard of Justin Raimondo and Eric Garris.
Oh, how sweet it will be to watch the non-interventionists squirm over this one. Oh how sweet…
What this has to do with libertarians, I can't imagine. Nancy Pelosi says and does all manner of stupid and insane things. Oh yes, we're squirming over what some Democratic Party apparatchik plans to do. You, uh, got our number.
Jesus, you're stupid, Dondero. I used our nifty Search feature to look up "Nancy Pelosi." Here are the first results in order:
With Hand on Heart: Pelosi Admits Israel Comes First – by Joshua Frank
Pelosi the Hawk by Stephen Zunes
Antiwar San Francisco — Tell Nancy Pelosi She’d Better Shape Up
Shame: The 'Antiwar' Democrats Who Sold Out by Jeremy Scahill
Protesting HCR 362 at Nancy Pelosi's House
What Did Nancy Know? by Justin Raimondo
Camp Pelosi: Nancy Lashes Out at the Antiwar Movement
And so on. Justin's practically created a cottage industry out of Pelosi-bashing. So go do the same search and tell me how many pro-Pelosi articles you find. Fvck Pelosi and fvck you.
Eric;
What the hell are you talking about? Antiwar.com is not and never has been a mouthpiece of the Democratic Party. Also, the libertarian movement has never been about party – Democrat or Republican.
So really all you've done is point out that you don't read this website, you don't understand who's behind it, you don't understand what libertarianism is, and you like to post on topics about which you don't know what the hell you're talking about.
Bwahahahahahahahaha!!!!! Are you friggin' kidding me? AntiWar.com not a mouthpiece for the Democrat Party. My gosh. This website, eats, breaths, sleeps, and sh*ts Pro-Democrat. It's like a mouthpiece for Democrat Party Central. Every day in and day out, it's bash Republicans. Bash Bush. Bash Sarah Palin.
Left Libertarian = alliance with the Leftwing. It's not rocket science. Duh!
*face palm*
Eric Dondero = zealous partisan devotee equipped with the association fallacies and conceptual limitations that come standard with myopia and manichaeism.
I don't know what weird issues you had with Justin back in the old days — he probably turned you down when you made a pass at him — but go be a bitter old queen somewhere else.
My issue with Justin? Happened in 1988, at the Republican National Convention in New Orleans. I was working as Ron Paul's Personal Aide, in his Libertarian Presidential campaign. We had a whole gig set up for the campaign. Had some endorsements lined up from top GOPers. Were invited inside the convention hall. Then Justin came and ruined it all, by screaming at the Republican delegates, that he was a "Libertarian," and he was "Queer and Proud." Shaking his fists at them.
Ruined the whole deal for us. No Republicans would have anything to do with us Libertarians after that.
Yeah, sounds like if not for Justin, libertarians would be (anti-)ruling this place! But seriously, you're pro-war, fine, so are a lot of people, but I don't see the point of pretending any of us here are pro-Democrat when the facts can be so easily and quickly checked. Try more elaborate and harder to deflect lies next time.
What about Pat Buchanan? He's antiwar. Is he a Democrat? You don't have to be a Democrat to be antiwar. Antiwar.com only bashes pro-war politicians whether they're Republicans or Democrats.
Nergol, don't tell me I don't understand who is behind this website. I've known Garris and Raimondo for over 25 years. I know where the funding comes. I know who backs this site. I know what their agenda is.
You are obviously a Newbie, and are clueless on libertarian movement history.
"I know where the funding comes. I know who backs this site. I know what their agenda is."
Well, if Big Islam, Big Gay, and the Democratic National Committee would just go ahead and send us 40 grand, we could wrap up this fundraiser already.
We should hold out for Soros.
Well by all means please clue us in on The Really Big Secret.
Tell 'bout Raimondo & Garris; where the funding comes from; who backs this site; what "their agenda" is.
If you think/believe/Know that something ain't right then lay out the corpse for viewing. Don't you owe that much?
I wondered where TIM R was , He is back! ("Hi Tim" )as Eric Dondero. I like your new name better than your last one Tim, same old crap though!
Sorry, no Tim here. I am Eric Dondero Rittberg. If you wish to confirm my identity, I have my cell phone right by my side. Call me up right now 979-848-4575. Or, if you're too timid, listen to my blog talk radio show "Libertarian Politics Live." Andre and I had an episode last night. http://www.blogtalkradio.com/libertarian. Or, you can simple go to my website http://www.libertarianrepublican.net Click on the Contact page. You'll see my photo there.
Good thing you keep your phone nearby, wouldn't want to miss a call from your friend Jack Daniels.
I hope Ron Paul wrote your number down, lol.
I notice that Mr. Dondero fails to mention that Antiwar.com consistently bashes Obama, Harry Reid, and – yes, Nancy Pelosi.
wow, where the f*** did the Dumb de dumb Dumbdero come from? Still got that Ron Paul bug up his butt I see.
Did the liquor store burn down or something?
Anyone wanting a good laugh, just google "site:lewrockwell.com dondero" or "site:reason.com dondero" or just google dumbdero. 2007 was prime dumbdero.
Now that you all had your fun, how about explaining to us what the correct AntiWar libertarian position is on Pelosi's remarks?
Since you all hate those of us who question the Ground Zero Mosque, yet preach against the "evil" national security state, and all those "civil liberties violations," from Bush, Pelosi wanting to use the force of the state to investigate opponents of GZM, puts you all in quite the little quandry there, now doesn't it?
If you denounce Pelosi, than, alas, you're on the side of those of us who oppose GZM. And we all know, the last thing you want is to be aligned with anti-IslamoFascists on anything. But if you side with her, you look like hypocrites.
My guess, you'll remain silent, neither supporting her, or backing her. You'll avoid the issue. You'll bring up silly side issues. You'll deflect. Anything you can do to avoid taking a stance on this.
?
Since you all hate those of us who question the Ground Zero Mosque, yet preach against the "evil" national security state, and all those "civil liberties violations," from Bush, Pelosi wanting to use the force of the state to investigate opponents of GZM, puts you all in quite the little quandry there, now doesn't it?
No, it doesn't put us in any quandary. We're against the state inhibiting the free speech of all sorts of imbeciles, including you and your ilk. This is covered in the remedial course on libertarianism, which you evidently still haven't taken.
If you denounce Pelosi, than, alas, you're on the side of those of us who oppose GZM.
No, of course we're not. We support free speech for Fred Phelps, Pam Geller, and even you. I wouldn't weep if the earth opened up and swallowed you all, but I oppose any act of aggression against you.
My guess, you'll remain silent, neither supporting her, or backing her. You'll avoid the issue.
I wrote "fvck Pelosi" in a comment above. Clear enough?
Eric, libertarians believe in property rights and freedom of religion. On both those points, the "GZM" is within its rights. It is not a libertarian position to use the State to infringe on those rights. How can you dare call yourself a libertarian, Eric? You are nothing but a warmongering neocon.
"If you denounce Pelosi, than, alas, you're on the side of those of us who oppose GZM"
Hmm, I am not and adherent to any party, I dislike Pelosi, think the "community center" should move forward, and can't blame people for bashing Palin, Bush etc,… they leave themselves open by acting like idiots and demagogues. Same goes for any public figure who plays on fears created and sustained by those with a vested interest.
Dumbdero has a point, Randolph Bourne was kind of a wimp with his little cape, not a tough guy chickenhawk pseudo-warfighter like Dumbdero's tough guy hero Scoop and Dump Ghouliani, who couldn't even beat the thoroughly marginalized Ron Paul in a primary.
Ron Paul says what needed to be said (as usual):
From the Alex Jones Radio Show yesterday:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pH97yA00RX4
@9:03
Wonder what Newt et al think of Jews destroying the centuries-old Islamic Mamilla Cemetery in Jerusalem? Of course, it was necessary to destroy the cemetery so that a "Museum of Tolernace" could be built in its place. There must be an award for hypocricy waiting for a claimant.
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